Ever watch TV or work right up to the last minute before bed…sometimes past your usual bedtime? No big deal, right? Unfortunately, your body likes consistency – and here’s a look at what can actually happen to your sleep…
To introduce Zeology – our new blog focused on personal sleep stories and the science behind them – I wanted to share a story of my own.
When Sleep Became Personal
Dave Dickinson - CEO, Zeo Inc.
Until two years ago, I didn’t care about my sleep. I knew that I was not as mentally sharp with less sleep. I also had read somewhere that sleep deprivation was being correlated to some serious long term health issues (like heart disease and diabetes). I just wasn’t personally motivated to make any changes. For me, sleep was just the net result of another busy day. I’ll just get what I can get.
I’ll never forget the first time I used Zeo and got a look at my own sleep data. I didn’t like what I saw. I think I achieved the lowest reported ZQ up to that point. Our development team had not seen so few reported minutes in Deep sleep before. They asked me if I needed a nap.
I’ve learned a lot about my own sleep since then. For the first time in my life, I can honestly say that I really care about it, and I now strongly believe that my health and wellness depends upon it.
My Ideal Bedtime
Here’s just one of the lessons I’ve learned so far. For me, the difference between getting to bed on time (my new target is 10:30 p.m.) and going later (usually work-related) can mean more than just the lost time in bed.
Take a look at two of my personal sleep graphs – one that begins around 11:15 p.m. and the other around 12:15 a.m. and take note of the differences:
What you might notice:
- 2 wakeups (good, for me) vs 5 wakeups. When I go to bed too late, it usually means that I was in “e-mail jail” and that I went to bed too wired. I wake up more often. Said differently, I just don’t sleep as deeply.
- 25 minutes of Deep sleep vs. 5 minutes. I check my Deep sleep minutes first thing every morning. After I learned about the importance of restorative sleep phases (REM and Deep sleep), it has driven my desire for more. I rarely get only 5 minutes of Deep sleep; when I don’t get enough, I feel like I am missing out on some kind of deposit into my long-term health.
- Total Z of 6.5 hours vs 5.5 hours. That extra hour of sleep has a big impact on my day. You might guess that I am typically close to awake at 6 a.m. I have learned that the best way to improve my sleep starts with an earlier bed time. I now place a value on working or watching TV after 10 p.m. For me, it always comes at a cost.
Here’s the Important Lesson: An inconsistent sleep schedule is one of the 7 Sleep Stealers™. The sleep science community widely agrees that consistent bed time and rise time is a key to a better night’s sleep. Cutting an hour off the front end hurts your sleep more than just losing that hour of sleep.
But everyone’s sleep patterns are different. It’s really about finding out what works best for you and your lifestyle – I stopped comparing myself to other people for this reason. My personal ZQ target is 80. I need to use all of my sleep lessons to get there, but this personal goal drives my behavior now.
Welcome To The World of Zeology
I want to personally invite you to join this new kind of journey into self-discovery, to learn more about your sleep, to tell us what you think (using comments) and to share your sleep stories. We’re excited to hear your thoughts and will always be here to give our perspective from the scientific side of things.
What do you think has the biggest impact on your sleep?
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I sleep very well and bought the Zeo to make my sleep more productive. My metrics are right on target for my age per Zeo guidelines except that my wake time is usually around 5 minutes (way under my age norm). How can I get more Deep and REM at the expense of Light Sleep. I assume that this would be preferred, right ? Are there sleep websites that talk about issus with optimizing “healthy” sleepers vs discussions on sleep apnea, etc.
Hi Mike –
Looks like you are already engaged in your sleep data, which is great to see. The answer to your question about how to get more Deep and REM sleep isn’t a quick one because everyone’s sleep is different. We’ve designed the 7 Steps to Sleep Fitness (personalized email sleep coaching program) to guide you through an exploration of your sleep patterns to help you understand and take control of the factors most affecting your sleep. (If you haven’t already, you can enroll on the myZeo coaching site).
As you progress through the program, you’ll see how your Deep and REM sleep is affected by different factors – allowing you to make small & sustainable tweaks to your routine. But remember not to only focus on the sleep stats, sleep fitness is the ability to feel and perform your best (during the daytime) through the power of sleep.
In addition to the coaching program, you’ll find some great content in Healthy Sleep and the Sleep Information Center (from the ‘Links’ page of this blog) that you might find interesting. You’ll see that the underlying principles of sleep fitness are consistent across the board – the trick is finding the things that work for you.
An important point of clarity for any other readers – anyone who suspects that they might have a sleep disorder should consult their doctor.
Sorry for the long winded response – hope this helps!
-Derek
I have been using the Zeo for about 2 weeks and average a ZQ in the high 40′s. I have very little deep / REM sleep (50 Minutes/35 Minutes).
Taking 6 MCG of Melatonin doubles my REM but lowers (marginally) my deep sleep. With or without Melatonin I average 5-6 wake-ups.
I should add that i total about 4 hours sleep total
Anyone know how I can reduce my REM sleep. I immediatly go into REM as soon as the head device is attached. All my life I have felt dreamy even while awake. At night it feels like I am dreaming pretty much most of the night and wake up tired. REM is supposed to happen about an hour after sleep but my recording show REM even before I am asleep.
Hi matrox,
REM sleep is a variety of restorative sleep and is often associated with vivid dreaming and memory consolidation. Most people strive to maximize their restorative sleep.
It’s important to remember that if you suspect that you may have a sleep disorder, consult your physician.
Now I’m curious…. what is the lowest reported ZQ score?
Tough to say, Sherry. If someone takes a 1/2 hour nap with Zeo, their ZQ might be a 5… Some interesting trends are yet to emerge, though – more on those later.
-Derek
Here are the Stats for a 5 ZQ (Nap)
Total Z= :37 (minutes)
Wake= 5% :02, REM= 12% :05, Light= 83% :32, Deep= :00
Very interesting, Jim. What time of day did you take this nap? And how did you feel when you woke up?
Here are the Stats for a ZQ=6 Nap (Non-typical)
Start time 2:05pm, woke up with phone call at 2:41pm, tried to go back to sleep with the Relaxation .mp3 then finally slept from 4:10pm till 4:40pm.
I figure the “Wake time” counted as (minus) -5 points.
Total Z= 1:05 (hr:minutes)
Wake= 53% 1:14, REM= 18% :25, Light= 26% :37, Deep= 3% :04
My sleep earlier that day was ZQ=58, Total Z= 5:43, start time= 3:35am
So I definately had the “Sleep Drive” need for a nap. This one is not typical for me, with the long “Wake time”, my normal naps are 30 to 60 minutes. I feel pretty good after these naps, like my gas tank has been “topped off”.
I’m a 60 yr old retired shift worker, and it seems my “sweet spot” for Bed time is around 3:30am. The Zeo system has been fantastic for me to test out different start times, then see what happens to REM, Deep, and the “Feel” scores.
@Derek, To answer your questions, I started the ZQ=5 score nap at 2:55pm after once again getting a “short” sleep Total Z=5:38 earlier that day. If you are interested I could email in the associated ZeoSleep.DAT file.
@Derek, PS.
HOW do you guys get the “stacked” sleep graphs like the one at the top of this blog “It’s Past Your Bedtime…” and the one for “Kuji’s Trip to Taiwan”? I have several different Bed times I’ve been trying out and would like to compare in more detail what times the REM and Deep cycles
occur.
Hi Jim – thanks again for sharing. Great to hear that Zeo is helping you figure out an optimal bedtime. The reason I asked about the timing of your nap is because naps at different times during the day will have different attributes (e.g. morning naps will generally be less Deep, more REM).
Regarding the different ways to view your data, the CSV export/download feature allows you to view all of the data from your myZeo account in an excel spreadsheet. From there, it just depends on how flexibly you are with Excel to visualize that data. Regardless of visualization though, you may find this tool useful. Check out the blog post on the topic here: http://blog.myzeo.com/download-your-zeo-sleep-data-to-excel/
Thanks again and Sleep Well!
Matrox wrote: “…my recording show REM even before I am asleep.”
Derek@Zeo chose not to comment on this, but it seems to be a problem with Zeo that seems similar to a problem I’m having. This morning, for example, I woke at 3:15am, and tried to lie quietly with my eyes closed in the hope that I’d go back to sleep. Part of the time I did deep breathing exercises in the hope that I’d relax enough to fall back asleep. At 4am, I gave up and got out of bed. The Zeo shows that I was in REM sleep the entire time from 3:15am to 4am.
Now, I know that people often think the’ve been lying awake when they actually were asleep, and maybe that’s even the case with this. But it’s not credible to me that I was asleep for that entire time (I counted 20 deep breaths – which for me is usually about 5 minutes) and that I jumped out of bed within 2 minutes of waking up. Also, I’ve noticed this same thing several times – and I’ve only been using the Zeo for a week.
A defective Zeo?
Hi Gary,
You’ve touched on a few great points that I’ll do my best to answer.
There are a few things that could be causing this, one of which you mentioned – sometimes people think they’ve been lying awake when they actually were asleep. Steve’s blog post dives into a good level of detail on this (you can find that here), and one study he mentions provides a good example: people were only to perceive the time they were awake during the night with 45% accuracy.
A second possibility is that your headband that is not making clean contact with your forehead. This could be because hair is in the way, or (more likely) that the headband is somewhat loose and is moving around. The best way to gauge this is by putting the headband on and paying attention to the symbol on the bedside display that tells you whether or not there is good contact: if the display is flashing between ‘band with beams’ and ‘band on little person’ while you have the headband on and are lying down, there’s a good chance that it is too loose. If you think this is a possibility, give customer support a call at 1-888-myZeo-Help (1-888-699-3643) and they will walk you through the best approach.
And finally, our research (some of which has been conducted by third parties and showcased at professional sleep conferences around the world) has shown that Zeo is accurate at phasing sleep over the course of the night, but Zeo can occasionally have some difficulty in determining if you are in Wake, Light sleep or REM sleep at a single point in time – signals at/around the transition to sleep can look very similar to one another. For example, your level of relaxation due to the deep breathing in combination with eye movement could have led Zeo to believe you were in REM sleep. With that said, the aggregate data (your total Z, time in REM, time in Deep over the course of the entire night) compares very well with the results of a PSG (the gold standard for assessing sleep).
So the answer is probably some combination of these possibilities.
Thanks for sharing! Hope you find this information helpful.
The comments about believing I am awake but Zeo saying I was asleep resonate with me. I have gotten up to go to the bathroom and not seen that as “wake” time in the morning. I can understand the average 5-minute period and the brain signals that seem like sleep when they may not be. I note also your saying that people are not good at knowing when they were awake. My question is this: what is your definition of “awake” versus “asleep”? Not a brain wave definition, which I realize may be proprietary, but a functional definition, in terms of cognition and behavior. Thanks.
Hi Dick,
Thanks for the question.
There can be a special case around bathroom trips… If the Zeo Headband goes out of wireless range for a long duration, the Sleep Graph will display missing bars. However, if the headband goes out of range for a only short time (like if one wears it when they wake up to use the bathroom in the middle of the night), and then the person returns to bed and quickly falls back asleep, Zeo may report that the person was asleep during that entire time period (since it may have picked up less than 2 minutes of wake while it was in range).
As far as the functional definition of wake, we fall in line with Dr. Willam Dement’s (from ‘The Promise of Sleep’ – recently posted by James Skinner on the Facebook wall) which defines wake as:
- When there is a wall between the conscious mind and the outside world
- Immediately reversible
The trouble is that, no matter how you define it, the line between sleep and wake is very very fuzzy.
I hope this helps – but please don’t hesitate to let us know if you have any other questions or concerns.
-Derek
Derek,
Thanks for your comments. I have confirmed that the headband is firmly attached – display isn’t moving between the 2 symbols. Also, I’m convinced that, while I may not be perfect in assessing how much I’ve slept, the Zeo simply isn’t picking up times that I’m awake. I’ll toss and turn during the night – and even deliberately keep myself awake for a few minutes to see if the zeo picks it up, and it’s not showing it. Last night it said I slept like a baby – didn’t wake up once until I finally got up – no way that was true. And that’s the standard pattern.
So apparently the Zeo just can’t tell if I’m asleep or awake. And, to be honest, that alone is beginning to affect my sleep, because if I wake up, I sort of feel I need to get out of bed to keep the Zeo data meaningful, rather than lie in bed another 20 minutes with the small possibility of falling back asleep.
Unless we can find a way around this, I can’t see using the Zeo much longer.
Hi Gary,
Thanks for trying out our other suggestions. We’re sorry to hear that you are still having trouble – this is uncommon.
The one thing that I forgot to mention was that Zeo will only determine that you are in wake if it detects wake-like signals for 2 consecutive minutes; we wanted Zeo to align with what most people remember over the course of the night (because most people won’t remember awakenings that are shorter than that). And as I mentioned before, scientific research has shown that Zeo accurately phases sleep over the course of the night. Instead of analyzing the data on a minute-by-minute basis, the information is best taken as directional.
With all of that said, we’re sorry to hear that you sometimes find this weighing on you at night. We will be in touch with you separately regarding other possible resolutions.
Regards,
Derek
I just looked at Cause and effect and the other analysis tools. I asked you before about the concept of real statistical significance, but that is even more wanting here. Couldn’t you build in some statistical tests, so that when people look at two graphs they would know whether they are statistically significant or not. Otherwise, you’re just promoting simplistic, uninformed thinking.
Hi Dick – we appreciate the suggestion. The data itself is the first gateway to informed thinking, and we agree with you that informed thinking is the way to go.
With consumer products & services, it is important that the data (and results) remain tangible to the majority of people using the tools provided. Balancing the level of sophistication with usability (so that the tool doesn’t look too intimidating) is an art.
Are there any products or services that balance statistical sophistication with usability that you have used or seen?
We appreciate your feedback and your help!
-Derek
Tjanks for the challenge to find examples of statistical reasoning in most people’s lives. First of all, how many people, before they met Zeo, were aware of REM sleep and Sleep Stealers? You’re in the education business, and these are areas people obviously like being educated about. I strongly suspect they’re open to learning a little more.
Secondly, how about election polls – “a margin of error of plus or minus three points”? Everyone has heard this and has some clue what it means. My brother teaches statistics education to teachers and points out that many people don’t realize that this means three points of error for each percentage.
Anyway, what I would propose is a similar statement by each average – “this average has a margin of error of plus or minus X percentage points.” People can then see whether the difference is within our beyond the error. You could then have, in little letters, “Learn more” with a fuller explanation of confidence level and all, for those interested.
I know you don’t want to induce frustration, but if the “learn more” incorporated that person’s statistics (through boiler plate and variables) it could result in a simple statement like, “according to accepted standards of evidence there is/is not a significant different between the averages for [say] weekends and weekdays in your case.”
I think currently people are looking at 77 vs. 73 and are wondering whether that means anything or not. So not presenting statistics is leaving people confused also. You assert a scientific approach to sleep analysis. I think you owe it to your customers to go this step further.
I just got my zeo and started trying it out. Unless I am reading it wrong, I think it looks like I was up for an hour last night (from1-2), but I don’t remember that. I am tired, but is it possible I just don’t remember? I went to sleep around 11pm. Or maybe I have it hooked up wrong? I also take the headband off or it falls off at some point around 3am (both nights I tried it) so there is no data from 3am-7am. Is there any way to prevent that?
Hi Lisa – The extra wake may be a result of the headband (partly) falling off, or partly because it can be difficult to remember when you were awake at night (http://blog.myzeo.com/sleep-forgetting-to-remember-to-forget/). We will be in touch with you via email to work this out!